Jewish Musings, Monday 2/6

[lee058]

What’s on your mind — how to make kugel? This week’s Torah reading? Life goals? Prayer? We are all engaged in weight loss/weight maintenance journeys and we are all Jewish or at least interested in Judaism. We like to eat, we like to discuss. It is our goal here to provide each other support on our journeys, to share experiences, to call on our rich cultural heritage and texts, and to help each other grow spiritually.

Some of us take weekly turns starting the thread:

Angelika
Holly
Lee
Louise
Lynne
Peachy

And for those of you that stop by to read this thread without posting — you are welcome to do that but you are also welcome to chime in!

[lee058]

Hello and happy middle of the night to you (or good morning or whenever you're reading this). It's almost 2AM here in VA, and I woke up after a few hours sleep, so here I am. I woke up with a vivid image of the Death card from a tarot deck (I used to be into that), and thought it would make a good starting point for today's discussion. As I recall, the symbolism of the card is not actually about actually dying. Its symbolism is that of change. So to get it in a reading means that your life is about to have something dramatically different happen, changing the course of your life. How does this relate to Judaism and what we started discussing yesterday?

What really happens when we die? I've heard older Jewish people say that they don't worry about it, they'll find out soon enough. I appreciate that attitude. Some non-Jewish people are (in my opinion) too pre-occupied with this question, and put in a lot of energy thinking up scenarios with religious themes. I feel more at ease with the question myself, and although I have thought about it a lot over the years, it is not something always in the back of my mind, worrying if I am "good enough to go to heaven." I do believe that when we die, we will be reunited with our loved ones in some way, although I do not know how. I like to believe in a "cosmic consciousness" where we will understand a great many things that are unclear now. I do not think that when we die, poof, that's it, game over. I feel that in some way, we are reunited with God in ways that can't be described or even really understood in our current lives. I also feel that anyone who says that they know exactly what God does is (how can I put this politely?) full of it.

I have read accounts of people saying that they have almost died and saw a white light and felt the presence of loved ones. Are these hallucinations, or are they real? Many people feel that they are real. I don't have a strong opinion about this.

Anyway, I will stop writing for now. I want to mull these things over for a bit and then try to go back to sleep. See you later in the day, and have a peaceful rest of the night, Lee

[savtele]

Boker Tov All! I am comfortable with the concept of a continued awareness of some sort. I don't know about "heaven" or "world to come" - both ideas seem very organized and finite to me. Obviously (in my mind at least) if "we" continue to arrive there after our deaths here, it must be enough for all of us. Is it added on to at times? Is "time" a concept "there" - wherever that may be? Obviously, I have more questions than answers (I actually have NO answers) I'm fine with that.

Sometimes I'll be doing something & think: I wonder if Papa knows we are doing this? Or, watching The Tonight Show: does Johnny Carson know this is how this is going now?

I do believe that the connections we have do not break. That's why I "heard" my dad singing behind me, on the Fathers' Day after he died. It was a great comfort to me.

Of course, it is possible that the entire concept is an hallucination, put on by our brain in the throes of death. But then, that would be real also, right? And Vikings would experience Valhalla; Christians, heaven, hell or purgatory; Jews, the world-to-come; Buddhists a next cycle or the oneness with the universe. Whatever your concept would play out well in the seconds before your light goes out. Ingo has no memory of anything for 2 weeks prior to his event. No white light, nothing.

However it works out - we will be surprised! Or not!

[peachymom1]

I really like the way you ladies have articulated your ideas. One of my sisters recently asked me what I believe happens when we die. Sometimes it's your audience that makes it harder to answer.

We know that our physical bodies have a limited time here. But I believe there is something unique about each of us that doesn't die. Soul, energy, spirit... Not sure what to call it. It might seem as if we only live on through those who knew us, but it's impossible to know just how we touch other people's lives, and how those people go on to touch more people's lives. A single gesture or word can mean something to someone else that we have no knowledge or recollection of. We influence without knowing when or how.

You've given me a lot to think about. Thank you!

[hollygail]

I haven't used my tarot deck in some years... I bought myself a round deck; it was a feminist statement (things aren't only black or white, but there are 360 degrees of between). I liked it a lot. (I lost my Aleister Crowley deck in 1977; it didn't make it from Amsterdam to California. I never replaced it.)

I too believe that after the body's time ends, whatever it was that was our "spark of life" (spirit, soul, pick your favorite word) doesn't end. I don't go much beyond that statement though. Whether our "spirit/soul" (whatever) reunites with the Source of All or whether it remains a separate entity I haven't decided (I've been on both sides of that one). I do know that the memory of people whose bodies die remains with the living; only one example: I'm named for my father's father's mother (she was called Hannah in the US) and for my father's mother's mother (who was called Goldie in the US, although her Yiddish name, surprisingly enough, was not Golda), so the memory of those two great-grandmothers lives on...

[louise]

I love Angelika's "The connections we have do not break." I am also okay with not knowing. Today is my father's yartzeit and I "talked" to him when I lit the candle last night. More to ponder.

More mundane- I finally got the nerve to get on the scale today. Didn't have the nerve last week but I probably dropped a couple - followed the program reasonably well (though far from "perfect"). Anyway, mercifully, I weigh less than I expected.

[hollygail]

When I first read your opening today, Lee, I was reminded of a joke...

There are these two guys named Yossi and Chaim. They were best friends and were so obsessed with baseball that they would go to 60 games a year and analyze every scoreboard. They even promised each other that when one of them dies, he’ll back and tell the other whether there was baseball in heaven or not.

One night Chaim dies in his sleep after watching a Chicago White Sox game — Chicago won, so at least he died a happy man. The next day Chaim returns to earth to see his friend.

"Hi, Yossi.”

"Chaim, is it really you?"

"Hey, I told you I’d be back to tell you what’s up. And, you know Yossi, there’s good news and bad news."

"Okay. What’s the good news?"

"There is baseball in heaven."

"That’s great! What’s the bad news?"

"You’re pitching next Tuesday."

[peachymom1]

Holly, good one! I'm totally telling it at the dinner table tonight!

Louise,good for you for getting on that scale!

[lee058]

Hi again everybody. Love your comments!

I saw the orthopedic doctor today, and he said that my right rotator cuff is messed up. I am going to start physical therapy, and see him again around April when I have done the course of PT.

I'll check back later. Have a peaceful rest of the day, Lee

[hollygail]

Lee, take care!

And by the way, I posted on Sunday's thread last evening. Take a look...

[happysavta]

Has anyone seen the old Robbin Williams movie (1998) "What Dreams May Come"? Although I have to confess that my favorite movie about life after death was "Beetlejuice".